CULTS AND SECTS – xxxxxx [703]

This group, in common with Jehovah’s witnesses and others, also shun those prior members with whom they disagree, and by which  the resulting isolation and supremacy destroys family relationships. It is based on intellectualism, on who can outdo the other from a superior doctrinal point of view. They are also an exclusive sect, and, like the JW’s, take every opportunity to denigrate Christendom at large.

Their main fault is their inability to recognise that God has in Christ, dealt with sin and death forever for all time, at his own cost. Their faulty atonement doctrine leaves them with little comfort as they strive to emulate Christ and the apostles, try to copy them and repeat the overcoming of death that  Jesus achieved, within themselves, of their own strength, being that they do not believe that the Holy Spirit plays a part in man’s salvation. They believe that it is the written word that changes them as they acquire a superior knowledge (much like JW’s) over the mainstream churches.

Like JW’s also, because of the law based thinking (striving to keep “The commandments of Christ”) the stress placed on individuals and families, in attempting to generate this self righteousness, causes family and relationship breakdown.

It is unfortunate that groups such as these, set up along the lines of independent thought, sadly fail because of their pride, vanity and intellectual approach to theology, which results in an egotistical autonomy of existence and a religion which completely examples the verse “Without me you can do nothing”. They never reach the pinnacle of the meaning of the verse “And so we have come to believe and rely on the love God has for us.”

It is good to note that in some of these groups there has been a move away from their traditional background, but resistance to change has always been a major factor with  them. However, it has to be acknowledged that some people within these groups have seemingly come close to a knowledge of the real truth as opposed to the lie which xxxxxx is, and are bravely attempting to introduce the Spirit of truth to their meetings. If they were to denounce the writings of  xxxxxx and xxxxxx that would be a good start, as even some of their own members are embarrassed by them, but this would result in them being cut off by the ruling hierarchy, who seemingly do not understand the meaning of “Paid in full”.

Link    http://home.pacific.net.au/~amaxwell/bdigest/bd09bbs.htm

[this link dead]

9 thoughts on “CULTS AND SECTS – xxxxxx [703]

  1. It is not at all right what you want to believe your readers; Not all Christadelphian groups shun those who have done something terrible bad or who do not believe any more in God. It is not because a certain ecclesia would disfelloship some one that they would go over to shun that person, nor tha when there would be a group shunning some one that it would be general practice in that community or group.

    Shunning is something what should not happen and does not show the agapè love we (as Christadelphians) preach. The resulting isolation and supremacy would not only destroy family relationships it shall destroy many necessary relationships in the person his or her life which are necessary for a natural healthy growth. Much more damage can be done than good … so it is not at all productive to shun somebody and is not in line with what Jesus would do.

    You claim that Christadelphians are an exclusive sect, and, like the JW’s, take every opportunity to denigrate Christendom at large, which is again a lie or twisting the truth. We do agree on the fact that we say Trinitarians are not following the Biblical Truth but are following human doctrines, but we do not take every opportunity to denigrate Christendom at large.(Where do you get such an idea from?)

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  2. Hi Marcus, thanks again for your comment. If you want me to accept that your particular group is different to “normal” Christadelphian meetings then I can do that, but it means that you should also recognise that this difference exists. My words are based on actual observation over a long period of time, but if you are not seeing this in your part of the world there must be a wide variation and deviation from the fundamentals as laid down by the founders.The word denigrate means to criticise unfairly, and every time that Christendom is said to be “astray” it is being unfairly criticised because in the main it does reveal the truth. I admire your defence and representation of your faith but I think you should seriously consider the criticisms of those who have left and just why they react the way they do. I am sorry that in the general pursuance of doctrinal truth that it causes offence, I see little to be gained in further such critical activity. But I would say what I said in reply to your other post, Marcus, “keep searching for the truth”.

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    • Between all the religious groups, be them Jewish, Christian, Islamic, Confusian, Buddhist you always shall be able to find differences of opinion. In Christianity one would expect more believers and followers of Jesus Christ to understand what he meant with all the different parts in the body of Christ. In Christadelphianism, opposite to many other denominations in Christendom, there is the belief that it is God Who calls the people, and that it is the Holy Spirit (the Power of God) which brings people on the right track, if they are willing to be guided by Him. We do believe tht for each person there is an other way to climb th eJacob’s Ladder, and as such we accept that for certain people a totally different way may be chosen than for other people. Therefore we do not object people being in other denomination and never claim that they can only be saved when they belong to our denomination. We even believe that a person shall be able to enter the Kingdom of god when he is not baptised or does not belong to a ‘Church’ (something your church may not believe°, but we do believe judgment belongs to Christ and not to us human beings.

      I think lots of your wrong sayings about Christadelphians may have come because you not knowing enough Christadelphians, even perhaps never having attended a Church service or a Bible Study Class. I am sure that in case you would have brought up certain of your ideas about Christadelphians their theology in a Christadelphian Bible Study session, they would have been clarified by my brethren or sisters in that community. There, also you would have learned that shunning for example is not at all a practice in Christadelphianism. I do agree in some ecclessiae they go so far to take away the fellowship of a person or to exclude him from taking the symbols (what you perhaps would call ‘going to communion’), but they would never say he or she may not enter the ecclesia or may not take part of the service or of the Bible Class (a separate event in the week or weekend). As elder I, like many other responsible preachers of their ecclesia (church), am not keen on dis-fellowship, so how can you rime a more harsh action with our thought of preaching the love of Christ and the love of God?

      Like many denominations, each group in Christendom and in Christianity may have pro’s and contra’. Christadelphians on tht level are no better than any other Christian denomination for that matter. always, in every group, you shall encounter human fallible beings and as such each little community shall have its little and its big problems. Be it Roman Catholicism, Trinitarian Protestantism or Non-Trinitarian Protestantism, all churches have seen people coming and going; From all denominations can be found disillusioned people and on the net you might find complaining people about their previous religious groups. Awful things are said of the Catholic Church (where also awful things happened, like the paedophile clergy — but that does not make all those priests and nuns terrible beings and perverts), but you might also find people who tell about the terrible things that happened in their Calvinist upbringing (incredible amount of complaints because of it conservatism),. But the Anglicans and Lutherans do not escape it either. In every denomination you might find people who are very angry about their previous denomination, and often we find similar stories of what they experienced, though just the name of the denomination or Church is different … it all like copies of human experience because of human actions and reactions, often also build on misunderstandings or certain individuals (families) wanting ‘to be more holy than the pope’. We should have an eye and understanding for that.

      It is nice to hear that you are concerned about my ‘soul salvation’.
      Being brought up in an Old Roman Catholic family, having experienced several Eucharistic celebrations, metten, praise, paternoster sessions, having been an altar boy or acolyte and even having thought of becoming a priest, In the 1950ies I saw all the heathen rites of that church and the discrepancy with the Bible texts. I loved Pope John XXIII his changes wanting to bring the bible more in the centre-point of the service and in the language of the people…. But all the popes after him destroyed or turned back what he had accomplished. After some church shopping in the 1960s, after having been playing part in a Roman Charismatic Church, I found a church which was in line with what the bible taught, a non-Trinitarian Baptist Church. In the 1980ies and 1990ies the Southern Baptist Union was pushing more and more to the Trinitarian teaching which made thousands of Baptist brethren and sisters leave the Baptist Church. Worldwide, most of them went to the Jehovah’s Witness and an other great part to the Church of God and to the Church of Abrahamic Faith. Others found their way to the Nazarene Friends, Restored Church and/or Restoration Church.
      I could not agree with the WTBTS their organisation and several of their teachings. Finding it more important to follow the bible, for me the infallible Word of God, I found in the Christadelphians a group or church which follows and tries to live according to the Words of the Bible. But, like previous churches, if they would go away from the biblical teaching I would not mind to change again from denomination. Once I was rebaptised to become a member of that denomination I also came to know how many divisions there too can be found and came to know how also there, we have to face the human condition and the problems of people their relationship with each other and with other groups in the denomination. On the net you can even find articles about the problems I encountered as the responsible for one Christadelphian group, trying to unite the many different Christadelphian groups in Belgium … to no avail.
      I want you to let you know that having so many groups in one denomination does not have to mean they are wrong or are false, it is just a way of a different point of view and a different choice of way of life. The Benedictines, Franciscans, Fathers of the Holy Heart, all the Monastic schools belonging to Catholicism do not have to be against each other and do not mean they are schisms.

      It might have taken me many years, not to say many decades, before I was sure to have found the truth, because when a Baptist I also had sometimes moments of doubt and had arguments with people who wanted to have me believe we were in the minority we would have to be wrong. Looking more at the preachings of the Nazarene rebbe I started more and more to understand what it is “being of the world” and what it means walking on the broad road or the narrow road Jesus is talking about to enter the narrow gate.

      I became a Christadelphian because their teachings were and are still in line with what the Bible says. I do know, lots of people keep thinking in their dogmatic way and say or think “god the son” when in the bible is written “son of God”. Because of those people holding fast on their childhood teachings many do have difficulties to understand and/or accept that Jesus is “the way to God” and/or that Jesus is the “Sent one from God” (not God having come down on earth) or the “Authorised one from God” which all can be found in the Bible, but does not fit the theory that God would have come down to earth. Many also do forget that God knows everything and that He is an eternal Spirit Being (omniscient, omnipotent), but that Jesus was a man of flesh and blood who told his disciples he is not spirit and can not do anything without his heavenly Father, the God Who is greater than him. Jesus never claimed to be God or to know everything. The opposite Jesus said about certain things he did not know that it was not given to him to know them, but only to God.

      Being brought up in a very conservative family, also having had lots of problems with my family for the profession I had chosen in the end (Ballet), I did not take such a negative stance against my parents nor their religion, but found the love of God and saw the attitude of His son, which should be an example for every person who wants to call himself a Christian (in whatever denomination he wants to live). It may have taken me also many years before I came to the Biblical Truth, but I think I may have found it and for sure find it much more important to belong to Christ and his church than to belong to a favoured ‘Christian denomination’ or ‘popular church’, which I do agree may have much more followers.

      As such you say “keep searching for the truth” makes me to respond that I am pleased that, already many years ago, (I think) I may say I have found the Bible as my Guide and that I shall continue to search the Bible to come to more knowledge and to be able to do my work for God better, following up the task Jesus has given his followers to preach the coming Kingdom of God.

      That the God of Abraham and Christ may bless and guide you.

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      • Dear Marcus. Thanks for your generous and honest letter. There is much I agree with you on, and I would sincerely like to discuss many of the points you have mentioned, but time is probably against us, unless God desires further communication. I will say that you appear to be highly qualified for where you are, and to express the idea of unification of differing groups is highly admirable. But we must address the main and apparent point of difference between us, which is, was it God’s intent to have us believe that our sin and death has been dealt with in Jesus’ body on the basis of accepting His sacrifice by faith in his blood, or not? You see, this is where it all seems to go wrong. Scripture appears to be saying that by faith in his blood, our heart and conscience is cleansed, and that it is this very thing which is God’s aim, purpose and intention, that by/in this cleansing people are renewed. Roberts and followers appear to be offering a different understanding which says that this simple cleansing of the heart is not enough. It is this difference which stands between us, is this not correct? I had written a page but which disappeared with a computer glitch, but have since written more which I may reproduce on the comment on the other post, but not to “muddy the waters” I will wait to hear from you on this atonement issue. Thanks Marcus, my deep appreciation for your wonderful and comprehensive understanding you have given me, of where you are coming from!

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      • Yes it is that difference, we thinking like James, that faith without works is death. We believing that when a reborn person keeps, are goes, sinning without showing repentance, he shall not be allowed to enter the Kingdom. Whilst believe, you all are saved and as such may still sin, may fornicate, steel or murder, we nor I can agree with that. All are given the Grace of salvation for nothing. But like as I told with my example of the present you may receive from some one, you shall have to do something with it (Even when it would be just eating the nice chocolates.) It shall demand works (going the right way).

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      • Hi Marcus. Yes of course, the whole point of it is a change of life, which amounts to leaving the captivity of sin and being captive to Christ, to righteousness. But Corinthians does clarify this by saying that a believer can be saved even if his works do not stand.

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  3. Dear Marcus, I think this has gone on far enough, there is no end to it. In respect for you, I will remove the words Christadelphian, Christadelphianism, and Christadelphia from my posts. It may take some time, but it will be done.

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  4. Pingback: Not according to legal description of a cult – Unmasking anti Jehovah sites and people

  5. Pingback: Those willing to tarnish – Unmasking anti Jehovah sites and people

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